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Cpf investment vs cash investment

Criteria:

above 21; not undischarged bankruptcy, CPF OA >$20.000.00.

bring NRIC and your latest CPF statement to any of DBS, UOB or OCBC to open your CPF investment acct. Pse note that only UOB offers Gold buy/sell service, less Gold ETF.

Good luck.

Geneva88      ( Date: 13-Oct-2008 22:59) Posted: Sorry Digging old thread.  If I would like to use CPF to invest, my broker asked me to give him the CPF  investemnt bank and account number. Does this have to be applied through the 3 banks that are authorized by CPF to handle CPFIS?   Thanks

 

Sorry Digging old thread.

 If I would like to use CPF to invest, my broker asked me to give him the CPF  investemnt bank and account number.

Does this have to be applied through the 3 banks that are authorized by CPF to handle CPFIS?

 

Thanks 

 

Wah...really very difficult to touch money from CPF...haha.

Thanks bocelli, TradeChancellor, tiandi and duststorm (sorry if i miss anyone out) for all valuable infos, so many things have to be taken into consideration, correct dates when doing calculations etc, i think better be super duper extra careful when using CPF for investments expecially those who are investing very frequently at a fast pace, i got 'frightened' once before so i guess i will just stick to my 'bottom' stock limit even if i have profited with CPF unless i am dead sure in using the extra money (which supposedly to be rightfully mine from capital gain ) for re-investments.

Cheers to all !!!

 

taking the example by rouge...

Please take note that the below scenario not does include the related fees and charges for purchasing of stocks & shares, or other withdrawals/deposits (during the period of calculation) for simple calculation purposes

Initial CPFOA Amount: $100k

Investible Amount on "Approved" Shares: $35k

Amount used: $35k, Investment Limit =0

Assuming that shares sold off at gain/dividend of $10k: $45k

the $45K is transferred back to ur CPFIS (agent bank) acct

Avail Bal in CPFIS is $45K, Investment limit is revert back to $35K

if now u still want to invest in shares now, limit is $35k . Profit is not taken into account till u transfer back to CPFOA for calculation of investment limit

CPF update on investment limit on the monthly basis, somewhere on the 11th of the mth

Say u transfer back the $45k back to CPFOA,
New CPFOA balance: $115k


after update;
New investible limit: 35% of $110k = $38,500

 

Correct me if i'm wrong, but this 35% does not include profits rite? Because I have about 50k in OA (profits inclusive), but can invest only about 14k, which is less than 35%, therefore i assumed it means 35% of ccont ccccvggributions  contributions only.

 

 

Skeleton, your Question on "As long as wat ever amount is in CPFIS (with agent bank) we can fully utilise them...unless money is being transferrd back to CPFOA (then the 35% investible amount applies)." is correct.

 Note that you have your own control over the transfer of money between agent bank,


below is cut form CPF Q&A on this subject.

Q:	How do I transfer the cash balance in my CPF Investment Account to my Ordinary Account?
A:	You may do so at any time using your agent bank's facilities (e.g. ATMs or phone-banking facilities). You may also make the transfer over the counter at the bank. Your agent bank will also automatically transfer the cash balance held in your CPF Investment Account to your CPF Ordinary Account (at the end of the month) if your Investment Account has been inactive (i.e. if you have not made any investment transactions) for two consecutive months. If you have been unsuccessful in an IPO application, your agent bank will transfer the unused CPF for the IPO application to your Ordinary Account at the end of the month.

 

 

 U may use this link to see other Q&A

http://mycpf.cpf.gov.sg/CPF/Templates/SubPage_Template.aspx?NRMODE=Published&NRORIGINALURL=%2fMembers%2fGen-Info%2fFaq%2fInvestment%2fINV%2ehtm&NRNODEGUID=%7bE2586957-683D-4D26-83BB-E5F3B5C3A9C3%7d&NRCACHEHINT=Guest#Q1 

Note that your calculation of investment limit need to take into account the cut off date  that CPF recalculate and CPF calculation is based on the balance at end of previous month.., you should not use your own formula of calculation on 'daily basis'.

.below is copy from CPF website on this subject Q5  for your reading

 

5. How can I check the amount of CPF savings I have available for investment?
      To check the amount you have available for investment under the CPFIS-OA and/or CPFIS-SA, you can:
      a.     Login to CPF website to access via my cpf Online Services ? My Statement using your SingPass; or
      b.     Use your mobile phone to access mPAL - my cpf using your CPF Phone PIN; or
      c.     Come personally to any CPF Service Centres with your identity card.
 
      Your stock and gold limits are updated on the 11th of every month, based on your balances at the end of the previous month. The limits will be updated on the 12th if 10th is a Sunday/Public Holiday.
Please see the example in Annex B.

Before you commit to an investment, you should take into account transactions affecting your Ordinary Account and Special Account balances (eg. investment transactions which have yet to be settled, monthly housing instalments, lump-sum housing payments, etc). This is because such transactions could change your amount available for investment. If you invest but your amount available for investment is insufficient, your transaction will fail and you may even need to pay cash to settle the transaction. In addition, you will have to bear the failed transaction fees.

 

skeleton, thanks for pointing out my mis-calculation. you are right-> figure should be $110k.. cheers. thanks again.

 

When you sell your investments, the sale proceeds will be credited into your CPF Investment Account. The monies will remain in your CPF Investment Account unless you instruct your agent bank to effect the refund into your CPF Ordinary Account.



Oh...after reading thru again...i think i got it now...the difference is between CPFIS and CPFOA.

As long as wat ever amount is in CPFIS (with agent bank) we can fully utilise them...unless money is being transferrd back to CPFOA (then the 35% investible amount applies).

Correct me if i am wrong.

Thanks

 

Assuming that shares sold off at gain/dividend of $10k: $45k credited back into CPFOA

New CPFOA balance: $105k

Sorry, rogue trader, no offence ok, i don't really get your calaculation...how did u derived with only $105K if the profit is $10k while initial investible amount is $100K ? Shouldn't New CPFOA balance be $110K ?

Thanks in advance

 

Thanks guys for all the replies, i think you guys are of great help in this CPF issue as i am very lazy and didn't bother to check my statement after i started trading about 3-4 months back using my CPFOA.

I remembered using all 35% (near to $70K) for my initial investment, made about 18% profit from the very 1st investment, SOLD and BUY again on the next day with nearly $80K and was told by my brokerage firm i am investing in CASH instead of CPF as instructed by my agent bank as i have insufficient stock limit ....luckily, the counter i bought went up and i sold on the 4th day which they took it as CONTRA (so don't have to top up with CASH).

Now my entire nearly CPF $70K is still  invested with only a SINGLE counter (ArianeCorp @ 0.075 in May)which is making money but i am not letting go as yet....my only doubt is if i sell it off at a later stage with profit.....how many days do i have to actually whack the entire amount (including the profits into another counter before it is transfer back to CPFOA by agent bank ?) or ...if i do not understand wrongly, like wat rogue_trader had mentioned...they will all definitely go back to CPFOA and the NEW 35%  (higher in this scenerio) can then be withdrawn for investing again ? OR is there any other way like telling agent bank/brokerage firm NOT to transfer back to CPFOA ?

Thanks in advance for all kind and helpful replies.

 

i knew abt this becos i been checking my cpf ac in website too

but what i started this year when i trade heavily using cpf till now, i didn't realise a 1k increase even though i've made some $$$

so i was advised by my agent bank to stop trading when i sell everything and till cpf adjust my new investible limits

is this true ?

but i can't stop trading, how can one stop trading in a bull run like this ?

 

i think tiandi had done us a great deal by posting the "link"..

 

skeleton, I used the max limit of my available cpfoa (everytime in out 1) and didn't really go thru the statements.. bt if i not wrong, let use the below scenario as example (again, pls do correct me or just add on if i wrong somewhere or whatsoever):

 

Please take note that the below scenario not does include the related fees and charges for purchasing of stocks & shares, or other withdrawals/deposits (during the period of calculation) for simple calculation purposes

Initial CPFOA Amount: $100k

Investible Amount on "Approved" Shares: $35k

Amount used: $35k

Assuming that shares sold off at gain/dividend of $10k: $45k credited back into CPFOA

New CPFOA balance: $105k

New investible limit: 35% of $105k = $36, 750.00

 

Hope this help.

 

I been investing regularly using my cpf

QN: if I invest 10k, made proft 10k, but I can only use 10k still for my next purchase instead of 20k as told by my agent bank, unless I instruct them to return all 20k to cpf after reciving this 20k , then i instruct CPF to manually re-calculate my NEW investible limit

then finally, I can make use of my profits (after taking 35% adj) maybe say 15k for investment

is this true ?

but because I keep investing every 2-3 days so I could never allow them the chance to recalculate my investible limit, so until now i still could only use 10k for investment, am i right ?

 

 

As CPF Board is paying 2.5% interest  calculated on monthly basis and the agent bank is paying interest  calculated on daily basis, it is advisable to do your own internet transfer of the CPF monies to your CPF account during the last few working days of the month. This way, you will maximise the interest earn both from the agent bank and also the CPF Board. 

If you let the agent bank to automatically transfer the monies back to your CPF account, you will lose out on the interest payable by CPF.  However, if you transfer the monies to your CPF account too early, you will lose out on the interest payable by the agent bank.  You will be worst off  if you let your agent bank do the transfer automatically as they only do so 2 or 3 months once.

 

 

 

 

u may find Q&A in CPF website...http://mycpf.cpf.gov.sg/Members/Gen-Info/FAQ/Investment/INV.htm 

example of some Q&A, remember there is a Ordinary acount and Special Account 

Q:	How do I transfer the cash balance in my CPF Investment Account to my Ordinary Account?
A:	You may do so at any time using your agent bank's facilities (e.g. ATMs or phone-banking facilities). You may also make the transfer over the counter at the bank. Your agent bank will also automatically transfer the cash balance held in your CPF Investment Account to your CPF Ordinary Account (at the end of the month) if your Investment Account has been inactive (i.e. if you have not made any investment transactions) for two consecutive months. If you have been unsuccessful in an IPO application, your agent bank will transfer the unused CPF for the IPO application to your Ordinary Account at the end of the month.   Q: What happens when I sell my investments bought under the scheme?  A: CPFIS-OA CPFIS-SA When you sell your investments, the sale proceeds will be credited into your CPF Investment Account. The monies will remain in your CPF Investment Account unless you instruct your agent bank to effect the refund into your CPF Ordinary Account. When you sell your investments, the sale proceeds will be credited into your CPF Special Account.

 

Q:	Can I withdraw my investment profits?
A:	Profits made from investments under the CPFIS-OA and/or CPFIS-SA are not withdrawable as the purpose of investing is to grow your savings for retirement. However, the profits can be used for other CPF schemes, subject to the terms and conditions of these schemes.

 

hi skeleton -> my recent experience in yr eg is that based on the 35% cal, u can only invest bck close to abt $10k. Suggest u counter-check. In a shortfall situation, you will be required to top up cash.

Also, unlike those of cash stl, u will have to wait for usually T+5 bf u are allowed to buy using the liquidation proceeds.

 

 

Hi duststorm,

what i heard from was different leh, say if u have $10K (35% of ur CPF-OA) and u invested all $10K and profit $5K, the proceeds will still be in the agent bank account and u can use $15K to invest next time (before the agent bank credict the profit $5K into ur CPFOA).

Unless like wat Rogue_Trader mentioned, all dividends/profits ($5K in this example) are credited into ur CPFOA account leaving with only the initial 35% ($10K in this example) for next investment.

Any one can clarify ?

 

 

do ensure u have sufficient stock limit before u invest.

FYI, when the proceeds from selling ur shares are transferred to ur CPFIS acct, the profits u earn do no add up to the stock limit

 

really??!!! hmm...sorry abt that cos i was reading the book on "capital markets & financial advisory services" and it's written as that.  thanks for the info..

CPFIS is a CPF investment scheme.  it has CPFIS-OA (full balance can be used for fund mgt, unit trusts, FD, gov bonds, ILP, 35% on shares, 10% on gold) & CPFIS-SA (full balance can be used in FD, gov bonds and selected ILP/unit trusts/ETF).